Ethical dilemma

29 public posts in this discussion.

Post 1

I need some input to help me know how to best approach this situation.

I brought my laptop into work the other day, and after switching it on, was notified that there were wireless networks in the area available to log into.

So I did, not thinking for half a moment that it would be unsecured. But then again, this IS Darwin. So sure enough - connected at 54Mb/s. Next, was told there was a new device available for me - it was the router. I tried logging into it using the default admin/password - router settings at my fingertips.

Now at this point, if you are thinking, "Cool! Free internet access! Hack into their network!", then you are the type of person I am NOT wanting feedback from.

The whole point of this story is, what is the best way to approach this business and say, "Hey, dickhead, you obviously don't have any IT person working for you. This is the situation - do you want it fixed?"

It wasn't as if I was purposely trying to hack in - it's just there, and extremely unsecured (and no, I'm not going to let you know where it is :-P ).

Not sure if I should try the freelancer approach or not. Or just ignore it, and let them find out the hard way. Or use their network printer and send them a message on it!!

Post 2

Use the printer :P

Post 3

I'd just tell em "fellas I can see your network from here and logon"
Maybe suggest a case of beer to fix it :P

After that they will use you for their IT needs and you get more free beer.

Post 4

ZOMG HAX!!! Seriously...I think you should arrange an appointment with whoever is in charge there, take your laptop with you, and SHOW them what happened. How you sat down, turned on your laptop and it picked up their network. If you show them they wont go calling hacker on your arse.

Nothing unethical about accidently finding someones open netork, so long as you dont exploit it.

That said if their IT department is dumb enough to have a completely unsecure network, then they wont notice your internet usage :p j/k

Edit: Yeah use their printer...printout "Your network is unsecure, I logged in from my laptop, call me on <insert phone number> to fix it for you" :p

Post 5

it would be unethical if u dont tell them!! i mean some people just have no idea.. Just call them and ask to talk to the mananger..and say look i was working Away and i found this etc etc.. tell them your story.. then suggest to get it fixed asap by you or there IT people who put it there in the first place.!

EDIT.. i have done the printer one before.. :)

Post 6

ummmm just tell them, i'd say a simple use of the english language should be ok???no need to call them names tho:p :p

unless you have abused the connection for the last two weeks, then don't say anything incase they wanna get nasty.

Post 7

Well that was easy. Thanks Wrathlon - I went over there with my laptop, explained the situation. They were most appreciative, and very open to the idea of it being set up properly for the cost of a slab.

Coco - if you come to the next LAN, I'll share it with you! (Any preferences?)

Post 8

Email them to there username Reporting that there Connection is insecure leave your telephone number and say you will be happy to show them how to secure the router.

I have done it for 5 people so far and they are greatful it gives you money in your back pocket and saves them money.

free wireless is cool but only if its ment to be free :)

Post 9

So I'm interested what range to the network you detected it. Interested for security purposes only.

Post 10

um...not too good with measurements. Basically, the business directly across the road. Not sure where their router is, but probably (very roughly) 100 to 200 metres. I initially connected at 54Mbps, and settled around 22 to 24Mbps.

Post 11

You'd be surprised how many AP's are unsecured.... I've seen dozens that I've had to secure. And I'm only one tech...so how many are there total ?. 3 years ago when I worked for a local Wireless ISP we used to go around the CBD with a laptop and netstumbler and find all of the unsecured AP's. Some were government too !
Scary Stuff....

Post 12

Bribe them :D
Just go arrange meeting with the manager :D

Post 13

Which road is it across?? :P

Had a similar thing happen when I went to setup a wireless network at a friends place in Cullen Bay (right across from the high rises). There were 3 unsecured wireless networks sitting there at full speed with broadband access at my fingertips.

Couldn't tell which apartments they were, but I left them all nice little messages whatever way I could (networked printer, desktop .txt file etc) and explained the situation. Haven't been back since, but hopefully they got the picture and weren't too angry at the intrusion :P

Post 14

The intrusion is the bit to be careful of. In xaines case it was good, but going to somebody and saying hey you network is unsucure cause I just had access, whilst with most they will thank,

im sure there are pricks out there that will take it the wrong way and you may find yourself at the wrong end of the stick. Depending on which end of the stick you prefer.

Post 15

Yeh, agreed.

Post 16

I just found the perfect page to send their IT department:

http://www.albinoblacksheep.com/flash/youare.php

Post 17

HAHAHAHAH

Subtle Wrath, very subtle ;)

Post 18

XAINE, buddy... ill be coming to the next LAN :D

I went for a drive into town with a mate.... i believe its called War Driving or something...

and the amount of wireless AP's that were not secure was EXTREMELY funny... this was 1 year ago though...

however some were quite good...

I would have asked for a case of scotch ... :D maybe a little less though :D

Post 19

My home wireless AP used to be unsecured :P
Mates used to send me MSN messages, from their laptop, while parked on the street.

Post 20

mine's unsecured

but then i live in the middle of a 5 acre block

Post 21

Quote from brownie:
XAINE, buddy... ill be coming to the next LAN :D

I went for a drive into town with a mate.... i believe its called War Driving or something...

and the amount of wireless AP's that were not secure was EXTREMELY funny... this was 1 year ago though...

however some were quite good...

I would have asked for a case of scotch ... :D maybe a little less though :D

It is called war driving ..

And most are Laptops or small APS for the office that they are in ..

Post 22

Meh, mine's secured :)

Post 23

skycity has an unsecure network im using it right now :$ but apparently its free to hotel stayers :S

Post 24

You, uhm, probably shouldn't be using it... der.

Post 25

lol everytime I think of wardriving I think of this quote:
<Tommmo> we went for a war drive in the commo, i have a 300W inverter
<Tommmo> anyway so we found this AP.
<Tommmo> then i went to take off again
<Tommmo> and the lights went dim
<Tommmo> and the car stopped :D
<Tommmo> combination of high beam / aircon / 4 laptops + not much car movement made it go flat quick :)
<Tommmo> so we posted a call for help via IRC
<Rik> rofl
<Rage> hahaha nice
<Tommmo> (12:49am) * Aday-LAN (aday@vw18562.dft.com.au) has joined #whirlpool
<Tommmo> (12:49am) <Aday-LAN> Tommmo here.... smarm are you there???
<Tommmo> (12:50am) <Aday-LAN> MrShrub: where are you... ?
<Tommmo> (12:51am) <Aday-LAN> can someone jump start this car :)
<Tommmo> (12:51am) <Aday-LAN> We're.. umm stranded next to an open ap
<Tommmo> (12:51am) <MrShrub> lol...what?
<Tommmo> (12:51am) <MrShrub> HAHAHAHAHA
<Tommmo> >:D
<Tommmo> then the RACV guy turns up and he looks at everyone with laptops in the car outside someone's house at 1AM
<Tommmo> and says 'what the **** are u blokes doing' :D
<Rage> lol
<Rage> sifnt roll-start
<Rage> or was it auto?
<Tommmo> auto
<FreeFrag> ROFL!!
<Tommmo> i was worried they were gonna discover us iRCiing from their wireless
<Tommmo> and come out the front
<Tommmo> :D
<Rage> hahaa
<Tommmo> whilst stranded :D
<Rage> that'd be so funny
<Rage> "DRIVE MAN DRIVE!!!"
<Rage> "WE CANT"
<Tommmo> hahah..
<Tommmo> "START BITCH"
<Rage> "AAAAHHHHHHHH"
<Rage> heh
<Tommmo> we had an 8 port switch
<Tommmo> and an external omni antenna on the roof :)
<Rage> lol!
<Tommmo> the complete setup :)

Post 26

im staying at the casino tonight :P me won lots of monies :D

Post 27

And the relevance of this is.....?

Post 28

they have free wireless :D

Post 29

i think my wireless is secure, not that it matters, for some reason it wont work... but i think that could just be my flat mates f**ked laptop