ATTN: Darwin Early School Leavers

I am about to do the NT STAT test so I can get into university without completing my final years of school (dropped out in year 11).

I want to know how you found the test, easy hard, how well did you score, I would like to do a decent degree (ie. Law seems very interesting and what I am keen on at the moment).

It's a 2 hour multiple choice exam with 70 questions. I have two booklets of sample STAT tests to practice on, which I feel I have done reasonably well on, however I don't know how the scoring works. It's out of 200, with 140 being the pass mark and I need 170 to get into law.

If anyone knows of any way I can get additional study to help me get a high score or any information at all, please feel free to post below or contact me. I have attended one of the workshops on the STAT tests but they didn't really tell me anything that I couldn't have worked out myself.

Thanks for the response in advance ;)

I don't know what question the test asks but you can always do night classes at CSC or something. Or you could rock up to a uni lecture and just sit there and listen.

oh my god, im so moving to darwin if i get a shit vce result

damn oath man, you'd get into virtually any course you want ;)

If you drop out of school you shouldn't be able to get into uni :roll:

There are people who try their asses of, sacrificing their lives for school in their final year for a spot in universities.

yes but people who didnt go through school should get a chance too
just casue zereeper didnt go to school in yr 12 and get a TER dosnt mean he should never be allowd to go to uni

i am going to school now and doing yr 12
but i aint gonna get a TER anywyas so thats why they have these tests available

Good on the people that study their asses off.

But I don't see how that should discount people from being able to attend university without finishing school, you don't know everybody's circumstances and how their lives have affected their schooling, I think you should re-think before making a statement like that.

Aslo school is very unrelated to many of the courses at uni and people that don't get a high enough ter or complete year could still do better at particular courses at uni then someone who got a ter of 80+. So only allowing entry to people with a high TER is stupid in my opionion. Also can't you do the same thing to get into uni's downsouth?

actually through the NTU you cant get into ANY course without the background in schooling.

Most degrees in fact like Doctor, Vetinarian etc require yr 12 acceptable VCE results.

It is easier to get into more skill based rather then schooling based subjects - like computing, art, lawyer

Not to mention Darwin Universities dont have the state recognition of some of interstates. SO if your trying to get into a job and competing against someone with the same degree from say a NSW university (name one Jaques) they will get the nudge.

On the other hand it is an incredibly relaxed attitutude which i preferred as I never completed yr 12 myself :D

I think it depends on your attitude towards the pressure young kids are faced with now a days :(

I like the idea of high enter rankings, that way your in classes with likeminded people. Im aiming 96.5, so i can make Biomedical science. Good luck eh :)

Quote from JeC:
If you drop out of school you shouldn't be able to get into uni :roll:

If you'd said that this time last year, when I was working my fucking arse off getting through year 12 so I could go down to Canberra this year, I would have agreed most emphatically with you. I would have said that anyone who doesn't take the conventional path must burn in hell for all eternity. However, now I'm here, I've slacked up a bit. It is VERY difficult and stressful to get into university if you did not finish year 12; far more difficult and stressful then actual year 12 for most people. People who manage it have just as much right to be here as everyone else, and universities are designed to be bastions of freedom, learning, research and expression open for ALL people of ALL backgrounds, not some elitist, pious, self serving ego-pump for rich Sydney kids.

University is the promised land. It is absolutely awesome in every respect, and I cannot stress how important it is for every person now in high school to go on to higher education... all practical aspects aside, it is a blast, an absolute blast. It's hard, don't get me wrong, but it's also a blast... and you are studying only what you want to learn; you can take less subjects if you feel stressed, or even take a break for any length of time you want. Put simply, it is too awesome for anyone to be be barred from entering if they want it that badly.

I look at it this way: 120 out of 200 is about the marks you generally need to get in high school to get the TER of ~65 TER odd, at least last year, which is enough to get into any course at NTU and enough to get into most lower level courses at universities down south. ~85 is highly recommended for IT however, as that unlocks every single IT or Engineering course at ANU and most everywhere else. And 170 out of 200 would give you at least 90 TER... which is enough for law. Plus, this test is probably very difficult... getting 170 out of 200 for a test, specifically one which is just so very broad as this one, is difficult, make no mistake. I mean, in year 12 you can tailor your options to avoid subjects you're weak at (Maths in my case...), in this test you cannot avoid your weaknesses...

There's also one more thing. This might annoy some people, but it has to be said... high school is difficult, make no mistake. If someone dropped out of high school, they generally did it because they were lazy or a quitter. Note, generally. Most people who quit, when pressed, will admit that they left because they were slack... which is fine... the only problem is, that part of them that allowed them to give up when it got tough then; they'd better hope it leaves them before they start their uni, or else they will just quit there, invalidating the whole exercise... even so, it's FAR better to quit in uni (where you can go back and restart if you wish) then quit in high school (where things are far more difficult). And if you quit in uni, at least you have your high school degree...

Good luck, Reaps, Blue. See 'ya on the other side. :D As for actual test advice; read year 12 textbooks if you can get your hand on them. Plenty of graduates from last year (who hopefully still have their textbooks) will probably be happy to hand them over, if you just ask. Also, you may want to give Darwin High/CSC a call, and ask them if they have any resources for those attempting such tests (or students repeating grades, etc), in particular night classes, and see if you can go along to those... they will be of great assistance to you, far more then any textbook.

Again, best of luck...

Cramming for one two hour test or work your ass off the whole year THEN cram for up to 5 three hour tests... hmm :D I sure do hope the one test really IS hard. Can they really stuff enough content into that two hour test to allow you to properly display similar skills that several exams and a large amount of essays and assignments try do to?

okies, having been here and done this... i went the TEP method.... its 6 months of going to learn the basics of higher learning study, how to write essays and stuff... im pretty sure that you can do law after that 6 month corse.... this is if you fail the exam which i didnt even attempt (im a dumbass... go tafe)

hmm, no study habits.. ask someone who has done it?

Quote from ruin:
Cramming for one two hour test or work your ass off the whole year THEN cram for up to 5 three hour tests... hmm :D I sure do hope the one test really IS hard. Can they really stuff enough content into that two hour test to allow you to properly display similar skills that several exams and a large amount of essays and assignments try do to?

Then, by that logic, they "cheat" and get into uni, then fail because if they can't hack high school, they can't hack uni... What are you worried about?

Well by that logic, all high school might as well be voluntary.

my brother took the STAT test. he got something like 171/200.

i'll ask him what it was like when he gets home for you reaps.

Quote from SperO:
actually through the NTU you cant get into ANY course without the background in schooling.

But you dont need a TER of anything above 5

You might need to complete year 12 and get a TER but you can always do a Cert o doom and get into ze bachelOR or DIE ploma....like iZ did....bud iZ didnt compelete ZE cert 4 iZ wooZ doin yet if iZ did iZ wood be doin Ze Bachelor

Fact is not everyone can go through the school system, many fall through the cracks. Not because they aren't bright enough but because they just weren't compatiable with our school education system. There's many reasons.

People mature and also people find UNI a much better and easier place to learn. I know I do because everyone is mature, your studying what your interested in and so are most of the people around you. Everybody at UNI is there because they want to be there, no class disruptions, no teachers wasting time on trouble students etc.

Everyone comes to do year 12 and some do well and go on to big UNI's and do something like a medical degree. Some fail to complete it or just don't attempt it at all....no trouble, your only what...about 17, still very young. In the next few years you will mature like those around you and you'll think alright, I reckon I can do UNI I wanna give it a go. Nice to know that the option is there and that failing or not doing year 12 is not the end of the world.

I left year 12, got a 36,000 dollar traineeship and a cert 4 of network management out of it. I am now doing a Diploma of Netowork Engineering. No regrets at all. By the time i finish my diploma - depending on my marks. I could pretty much get into most uni's to do B IT

I finished year 12, got the most shit-arsed TER of 46, I am now currently having to correct my lecturer's on facts on the odd occaison. School just doesn't suit some people so they don't do really well at it. Doesn't mean they are any smarter/dumber than anyone else just means they are different to someone else. They should be allowed into Uni too, because someone shouldn't be discriminated against and prevented from becoming a success because they aren't "smart" in the way society determines the definition.

I've always maintained that one's TER does not reflect by ANY stretch one's ability, potential nor even in some cases knowledge.

I was a hater of school, did not enjoy my time at all.
Ended up completing English Studies, Maths 1, Maths 2, Physics and Biology in year 12. I passed and currently hold my NTCE :wink:

From what I learnt with the NTU or should I say CDU? :roll: Is it is very easy to get a spot within a course. Well IT seemed the place. When finding info about courses and stuff their I had a chat to some of the IT staff and many of them try to encourage people, whether they have a year 12 cert or not to give it a go. As lilu and reaper have said there are various other ways to getting into uni, and lilu stated a 6month course, theres also a 1 month course you can take that covers the same stuff quicker. And I also believe passes or credits in the 3 compulsory subjects under the TEP course will give you a pass (I cant think of the right word atm) in 1 of your common units in your degree. So in some ways this is not a bad way to get into uni and already have one unit completed ;)

As for me, I currently do Bach of IT, along with many members from GU (a lot I do know). I have to say it is very different to school. At first I found it rather odd trying to get used to the lecturers and their ways. Eventually it starts to become like a this forum in some sense, the environment is laidback, the lecturers (or to date) are always willing to spend some time to try and help, most are very nice people like many of yous here, and there are a few rude one (*cough* disc. maths 1a, sorry if that offends anyone).

I look at uni as something your wanting to do, meaning that your there for a reason and a reason that your willing to pay and spend your time for. Generally its much more enjoyable than school as your learning about things your into and willing to learn (except for Info Modelling *stupid class*). School in my opinion was crap, sure you have a little variation in what subjects you choose, but if your going for a solid TER, then your limited to the boring classes. It does become depressing and fairly hard on you for the last 2 years of school (damn what a sweet feeling when that last exam is done ;)).

All that said I believe everyone should be given the chance to attend uni, I'll honestly say im fairly good with computing and anything in that general area. A quick learner and as is the case now, most of the time Uni is boring and generally easy, but its getting better ;). So lets say I did 5 non computing/technically educating subjects, like sport or drama for example or I failed school. Yet I still have a solid computing mind. Does that not allow me to at least try... Well i think it should.

But I am thinking of deferring uni for a year or so, 13 years learning in a classroom is a damn long time to be honest. The nature of Uni, id say only do it if you have the patience and willingness to learn. I dont think I have it anymore, but thats me and I dont see it as a bad thing, ill get back to it in a year or so and continue :D

Damn got my life story for the last 3 years? lmao

I left school at 14 - got an apprenticeship - then did an adult apprenticeship - got Trade Cert in Auto Electrics and Motor Mechanics ... ended up as a service manager in a Toyota Dealership ....

Got bored ... chucked it in - did Adult Tertiary Entrance exam ( a bit like what you are doing ZeReaper ) ... aced that - went to uni ...did BSc Comp. Science .... got Network type job ... did MSc. Telecommunications 2 years ago ...

So my point is if you have the will and desire you will get into Uni or achieve other goals you may have ....

But in hindsight I would have done better to stay at school and then go straight to Uni ....

The issue I had was no guidance or help planning my future while still young and at school ...

So to all the youngun's out there ... study hard and do as well as you can at school ... Education and Qualifications are the yardsticks for today's employment market ...

A few notes in reply:

Whisper, brother, I hear you. My first year at Sydney University was a revelation.

Sper0, aside from Sydney University (the original and the best), NSW has UNSW, UWS, UTS, Club Mac (aka Macquarie), The Gong (aka Wollongong), The Nuke (aka Newcastle), New England, and Bathurst. I may have missed one in there somewhere, but never mind. Of these I have visited UNSW, UWS (all three main campuses - they're holes), UTS (its main campus is a skyscraper), Club Mac (ice-skating rink across the road), and the gong and the nuke, both of them with lovely bushland campuses and vibrant liberal clubs. (Did I mention the liberal clubs?)

As to the ease of entrance at NTU - with the change of name to Charles Darwin University, Prof. McKinnon and the incoming Vice Chancellor will be tightening up entrance across the board. Also a lot of the degree rules will be tightened in line with various national standards. For instance, it's looking like supplementary exams will be dramatically reduced in availability, or maybe even abolished.

CDU will be getting a lot more money per student from next year, so they will be able to pick and choose more. Watch out!

The whole point behind the ENTER and UNI's prerequisites is to do with places avalible, The more attractive and desired courses have higher scores. The reason for this, is to allow those who have worked hard enough, or are intelligent enough to cope with the course.
With Medicine however, there are alternate pathways into it. Its not based entirely off ENTER because the government understands that brainiacs dont nessicarily make the best doctors. There are also HEC's agreements, so if you apply for medicine, you can get in if you agree to practice as a doctor for 5 years in a rural area.
With Law, you can pathway into it through Arts at most major universities.
These two, Medicine and Law are on average the highest paid professions. So its no wonder its hard to get into. Lee, wish you all the best, if you want it bad enough, keep looking to get into the course! There are always ways to get into Law.
If i decide to, i can channel into Medicine from Biomedical Science, but that'll mean an extra few years of post-grad Uni :P

for those of us who've had to work hard and are currently gearing up for the exams ( :cry: :cry: :cry: ) it seems like a bit of a ripoff that people who dropped out can get into Uni by taking a single test. if they want it bad enough they should have to go back to school and do the hard yards like everyone else. they don't like the system? i've been there, done that, almost failed year 10 and considered dropping out. i'm still at school though, under my own steam, and i'll be finishing up soon. it's a game, and if people want to go to uni badly enough they'll play it.

Quote from "Whisper:
for rich Sydney kids....

true, and all the yr12 students out there are worried about your ter's etc - especially the students focusing on attaining high 90's if you reach this goal that is highly commendable and should have an equal chance to get into your preferred course. Unfortuantly, you may to compete against southern students who attained TER's of 99 etc mainly because they have been pounded with every question know to their subject (especially maths etc) and come exam time - they have done it all before. Agreeably there is nothing stopping us from doing the same but i still believe its utter bs the system they go through there

Quote from "Whisper:
. ~85 is highly recommended for IT however, as that unlocks every single IT or Engineering course at ANU and most everywhere else..

last time i checked it was 87.25 for aeronautical engineering and 99.3 for aeronautical engineering (space)

Thx nick.

Seqo any luck on talking to your brother???

Speaking as someone who decided to chuck uni in just two days ago: I wouldn't make it a big rush to get into the big wide world. We are all sitting here talking about uni being our desired goal with UAI's of 46, 89, 99 or what ever, but just like school, people fall through the cracks. No matter how much you want to get into that uni scene, I think you really need to pause and take a couple of deep breath - rationalise your aspirations.
There are degrees out there that mean nothing at all (cough cough...arts) and yet thousands of people enrole into them for some crazy reason. That time at school that we all seem to be dismissing is incredably valuable. Yes, we all probably hated it, but it has served as one of the most defining experiences of all of our lives. I expect that the board of studies realises that 12 years of schooling could be compacted into.....maybe less than three. However, I think we need to really cherish those extra nine years maybe less people will end up with meaningless degrees like arts.

Bah....I have no point, I'm a bum now. School leavers really should take a gap year, travel a bit, attempt to understand the opposite sex and live a little - bugger uni off as the bad smell that it is.

And just to make this clear - DONT ANYONE EVER ENROLE IN ARCHITECTURE ANYWHERE! - it's the worst degree in the world.

Quote from samid:
There are degrees out there that mean nothing at all (cough cough...arts) and yet thousands of people enrole into them for some crazy reason.
it's probably a wild guess, but maybe, just maybe, those people who enrol in arts wish to do a subject that they enjoy? but hey we all know that astrophysics and nuclear biochemistry mean "more" than other courses now don't we? if you want money do law or medicine. if you want to do something you enjoy rather than being a whore for the system, pick and choose because it's all subjective.

Samid,
I think there would be quite a few people out there that would be really annoyed with you saying that the arts mean nothing at all. All the clothes you wear, the designs of posters and other things alike, the scalptures u see, the television/movie actors and much much more is of something of the arts. For you to say that someones work means nothing at all, all their hard work time and effort they have put into uni.. thats really harsh

no, arts is evil...

theres a difference between applied art... and "the arts"

Quote from JeC:
If you drop out of school you shouldn't be able to get into uni :roll:

There are people who try their asses of, sacrificing their lives for school in their final year for a spot in universities.

and their are some peeps that stay in school till they are thirty nine and live off of the hard workers tax money and winge about how much hex fees are too. your point is very narrow!!

A "bah" on you all!
I wasn;t criticising the content of the degree guys. I was implying that so many people are now getting their arts degrees that it is now commanplace for a university graduate to have an arts degree (comparatively speaking).
I think it's fantastic that some people know exactly what they want and are able to achieve that. However...I know a whole bunch of people that fell into arts because they just missed out on law and are hoping to transfer or are doing it so that they are able to attempt a masters later on.

What you may be calling "harsh" w00p is what I call realistic, I was using it as an example and you've simply ignored my point (if I had one at all, I cant remember, it was a bit of a rant) and attempted to trivialise what I have said. Congrats :evil:

Quote from "Lucifer Dragar":
Quote from "JeC":
If you drop out of school you shouldn't be able to get into uni :roll:

There are people who try their asses of, sacrificing their lives for school in their final year for a spot in universities.

and their are some peeps that stay in school till they are thirty nine and live off of the hard workers tax money and winge about how much hex fees are too. your point is very narrow!!

um....isn't your point just as narrow dude....SEE I CAN TRIVIALISE TOO!

Quote from BlueDonkey:
last time i checked it was 87.25 for aeronautical engineering and 99.3 for aeronautical engineering (space)

Maybe elsewhere... the ANU considers all Engineering diciplines 'Engineering', including programming (Baka), so all you need to do is get into Engineering and you specialize in your final year... note that the programming aspect has only a year ago broken off into Software Engineering; before that it was straight Engineering... Software Engineering has the same TER as Engineering, and first year SE students do Engineering courses (such as Eng1121, Introduction to Engineering, and Engineering level maths courses not required for IT) as well...

who was trivialising, i was just pointing to the other end of the scale,

maybe everyone should go back to basics and go and work on a farm, or even just get out of the house more.

as you get older and experience other things your opinions will change and on that point all they are is opinions so if you disagree with anyones opinion it is your right to disagree, and bitch slap em if ya want!! :twisted:

mmm....bitchslap

and hey, I get out of the house plenty. I went and picked up my pizza yesterday rather than getting it delivered, how good am I?

and sorry dude, I see you point, I was just trying to be a shit to make my point. :)

Quote from samid:
Speaking as someone who decided to chuck uni in just two days ago:

But my entire point is, if you wanted to go back, you could. You didn't really quit, you simply stopped going; you can go back any time you wished. High school doesn't have that option, however...

um, I'm not sure I could reinrole :oops: .

School is far less flexible than uni when it comes to attendence, enrolement etc....but that final year when I happened across my english teacher smoking in school grounds, while skipping assembly made the two levels of education seem somewhat similar

I've been in the military since december 1999, and I'm now 21.

I think I have enough life experience to appreciate what an education would mean, and had enough of a break from schooling to be able to sit through another 4 years and concentrate well enough.

After going through the mistakes on the STAT test (practice) that I did, I only got a total of 5 wrong out of 70, that will be a good enough pass to get into law. I have one more practice test I can do, if I am happy with the results, I'll sit the test. If not then I can buy one more stat test to practice on.

Hex - a curse.
HECS - Higher Education Contributions Scheme.

Enroll, Enrollment.

Arts Degrees: English, Languages (Modern & Ancient), Classics, Sociology, History, Anthropology, Archaeology, etc etc

Fine Arts Degrees: Painting, Sculpting, Performance etc etc

Thankyou for your kind attention. Please continue.

El Presidente - Pernickety fuck

AKA "a Law Student".

Your a Law student?

What year?

Quote from ZeReaper:
Your a Law student?

What year?

I am. In my second year of law at NTU. Previously I was doing Science/Arts at Sydney Uni for two years, and I'd like to go back there later and clock a Science degree in computer science.

But for now, Law. I enjoy it.

not much, he's always out... bastard :P

he should be back from a lecture in about half an hour to an hour. will post again.

Quote from Whisper:
[quote:61648bafad="BlueDonkey"]last time i checked it was 87.25 for aeronautical engineering and 99.3 for aeronautical engineering (space)

Maybe elsewhere... the ANU considers all Engineering diciplines 'Engineering', including programming (Baka), so all you need to do is get into Engineering and you specialize in your final year... note that the programming aspect has only a year ago broken off into Software Engineering; before that it was straight Engineering... Software Engineering has the same TER as Engineering, and first year SE students do Engineering courses (such as Eng1121, Introduction to Engineering, and Engineering level maths courses not required for IT) as well...[/quote:61648bafad]

specialize in your final year - you mean for programing? it was my undrestanding that first year is basically common to all disciplines (as this is what my class was told) and after the first/second year everyone breaks off and does their own thing...

BD

Quote from "El Presidente":

Enroll, Enrollment.

Thankyou for your kind attention. Please continue.

un...I've got to say: isn't it enrol and enrolment?

yes, yes it is :lol:

Quote from "El Presidente:
I am. In my second year of law at NTU. Previously I was doing Science/Arts at Sydney Uni for two years, and I'd like to go back there later and clock a Science degree in computer science.

But for now, Law. I enjoy it.

Are you doing well?

Don't knock Arts Degrees.

I have an Arts Degree majoriing in history yet I am reposonsible for the co-ordination and movement of millions of dollars of stores. Previous to that I used to run three bars.

Arts is not about about what you learn, its more about the learning process.

Quote from El Presidente:

Enroll, Enrollment.

Quote from samid:

un...I've got to say: isn't it enrol and enrolment?

yes, yes it is :lol:

I think you'll find that authorities differ on the spelling. Some give enrollment, others give enrolment, not a few say that either is acceptable. Certainly either is an improvement on "enrolement".

If you like I'll look up the OED 2nd Edn at the NTU library and we can settle the question.

Quote from El Presidente:

But for now, Law. I enjoy it.
Quote from ZeReaper:

Are you doing well?

Yep. I find it comes naturally to me. Probably a bad thing to admit in public, but there it is.

ok dude....you're the law student in the house, I'll accept that. UNSW only accepts enrol, and I'm going to claim enrolement as a typo :oops:

Quote from samid:
ok dude....you're the law student in the house, I'll accept that. UNSW only accepts enrol, and I'm going to claim enrolement as a typo :oops:

Law students are arrogant a lot of the time, including this one. :D

lol. Nice to know that there is some humility left in some of your law bound bones, there is a god :o

El Pres what sort of field of law you going into???

I think I will do law (if I get a high enough STAT which I will do my best to do), but I don't know which field would be most interesting for me.

Any suggestions or what your finding interesting, well, any information you can give at all I suppose.

Ahhmm...

Sounds like ZeReaps is eyeing a degree... I know I'm old (but not cranky) and I know I can still get a degree (if I really put effort in getting one) so I think this'll be the right avenue to put it all up. I already have one and not happy with it (hence, I kinda changed gears in betwen and changed gears again in the professional arena). I shoulda listened to my guidance counselor then and not wasted my chance.[list:294cc0ce90]My questions are...[*:294cc0ce90]what's TER? Is it any different from Scholastic Aptitude Tests (SATs)?[*:294cc0ce90]how much does it take to get a degree in managment at a uni[/list:u:294cc0ce90]

GunZ man, come to darwin, sit a 2 hour multiple choice test, and you can do your course ;)

Quote from ZeReaper:
El Pres what sort of field of law you going into???

I've found that so far I enjoy "bread and butter" law, trusts and the like. Which is a definite bonus, as one can almost make a living on doing nothing but trusts, deeds, wills and the like.

As for specialising, I was giving thought to intellectual property in the world of computers & the internet. My long experience with computers, plus a (nearly-finished) degree in computer science would give me an edge in the field. It's looking to be very lucrative and interesting at this early stage of the game.

Constitutional law is also interesting, but limited these days. In the juicy cases one can get, it pays very well ($8k/day), but such cases grow fewer and fewer.

I am planning to specifically avoid family law and criminal law, doing only so much of either as is necessary to complete my degree and articles.

Quote from ZeReaper:

I think I will do law (if I get a high enough STAT which I will do my best to do), but I don't know which field would be most interesting for me.

One doesn't begin to specialise in law until at least third year. Don't fret about what you'll focus on. Law by itself is a 4-year fulltime degree, plus one year of articles/associateship/GCLP.

Quote from ZeReaper:
Any suggestions or what your finding interesting, well, any information you can give at all I suppose.

Be advised that the NTU staff mark much harder than southern universities. They are keen to dispel the image that NTU is a legal lightweight, and one way to do that is to mark hard. From memory only 40% of law students make it all the way through the course.