ATI cards are out out out

Has anyone seent the benchies on this thing???

my lord.

better performance. and less power consumption. that is to nvidia's offerings...

check out any hardware review site

www.tomshardware.com does a good job

Looks like the new Radeon is once again the choice over Nvidia if you like playing your games with FSAA and AF. Thanks to these Radeon's you'll not only be able to play with FSAA and AF enabled, but do it without big FPS sacrafices.

I've always loved the way that Aniso is a high priority for ATi. NV doesn't seem to pay too much attention to the fact that there cards are DOGS when Aniso is enabled. Especially any higher than 8x.

If the new technique for AA works a treat it will be a damm fine card

All i have to say to Nvidia's 8x FSAA is....

BAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAA!!

Quote:
R420 is what NV40 brought to the table in terms of performance, amplified, especially at its maximum AA mode. My 'ohmygod fast' exclamation on the second page really doesn't do X800 XT justice, it utterly obliterates anything that's gone before it when maximum respective AA modes are enabled, current 6800 Ultra included.

While NV40's 4X RGMS mode allows it to save some face, it's generally not enough face to matter. ATI's 6X mode is superior in quality and just as usable in performance, and on these newest generation accelerators, that absolutely matters.

It's the fastest and best looking graphics card on the planet, bar none.

how much you guys think this card will be???

and also, i'm wondering if our dollar value now has any influence of prices? i know its not as linear as having to pay only 30 something % more than the american's do but surely our dollar should have SOME means now of making prices a little cheaper? as a matter of fact...where exactly do australia get their hardware parts from? asia? europe?

around $900-"100 for the nice ones. (ATi-Sapphire)

Hercules and Asus will without doubt be the most expensive...

Nvidia's 8xAA is broken on a driver level afaik, so it can be fixed in a later driver release. That being said, ATi's 6xAA shits all over it anyway because of ATi's better sample patterns for AA. Also, Far Cry breaks with the 6800 Ultra whenever either Nvidia update their drivers or Crytek release a new patch, because of legacy N3x optimisations :roll:.

ATi wins again :D

Quote from Seqo:
I've always loved the way that Aniso is a high priority for ATi. NV doesn't seem to pay too much attention to the fact that there cards are DOGS when Aniso is enabled. Especially any higher than 8x.

Anisotropic filtering is the weakest point of ATi cards and is the only section that Nvidia actually beats it in this generation. Last generation Nvidia had botched triliniar filtering that looked shit which has been fixed with the NV40, but ATi had angle-dependant AF and still has it now, which means the AF changes in levels depending on what angle you're looking at it, afaik at 16xAF the level can drop to as low as 2xAF when looking at it from low angles...

Its ATi's AA that really owns nvidia 8)

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Quote from dualith:
Anisotropic filtering is the weakest point of ATi cards and is the only section that Nvidia actually beats it in this generation. Last generation Nvidia had botched triliniar filtering that looked shit which has been fixed with the NV40, but ATi had angle-dependant AF and still has it now, which means the AF changes in levels depending on what angle you're looking at it, afaik at 16xAF the level can drop to as low as 2xAF when looking at it from low angles...

Close, but not quite. The angle at which you see the AF doesn't make any difference to the IQ.

Quote from Hexus.net:
If R420's aniso algorithm has been changed from what's present on R360, I can't spot it. Its angle adaptive, which is somewhat suboptimal in terms of maximum possible image quality, but that maximum image quality is something that even R420-class hardware doesn't attempt at speed. Angle based aniso is needed for both good image quality and playable or usable framerates. It's a scheme adopted by NVIDIA for NV40, so all competing hardware in this class does the same thing.

ATi has also always been known for extremely high quality AF with little in the way of any performance hit, nVidia has not.

I thought the anandtech review was good - quite balanced.

I think that basically it's a tradeoff. If you like AA and AF and all the boozy trappings, ATI are "your man". If you want Shading 3.0, you need nVidia. If you want the best DX9 performance, pick the X800. If OpenGL games are your thing, the 6800s lead the pack.

I mean horses for courses and all.

... mind you this is all wanky speculation on my part, for as a lowly casual worker I cannot afford any of these lovely items. Did you know that Far Cry runs on a GF440MX? BrAiN DaNcE didn't. Who cares if it looks less like something rendered by a video card, and more as if it was rendered in crayon by a 12 year old? It runs, right? Right?

Get 144 12yo rendering and you might manage 60fps :P

sure...

and while we're at it..

let's go back to text based adventures

mwahahhahahahahah

Umm there not going to be THAT expensive... if at all they will be prob cheaper than the 9800XT when it was first released. The RRP of the x800 XT is like US$500, that like $AU690 (from my mind calculations)... Add a bit on for shipping n stuff and ure looking at AU$750

But if i was going to buy one (which i might) i would wait until all 4 cards are released (the two versions of Nvidia and Radeon), that will drive the prices down

All the cards start at $500US and they debut in Aus at ~double that price ($800 - 1100). It has been the case since the GeForce256 DDR. They will be that price in Aus upon release - unless an entirely new system of pricing is implemented by both companies.

Not to mention there will be more than 4 versions. 6950 Ultra is already in the process of being reviewed according to Anand's x800 review. And then there will be SE versions etc.

see though...that's the point i'm trying to make

back in the days of the geforce256, our dollar plumeted to the 50 cent level. its stayed like that for the good part until the start of this year...

radeon 9800xt's debuted last year while our dollar was still down... i think

with the value of our dollar now, i'm just trying to see if there would be any compensation made?

feel free to correct me with any wrong facts i've made

Our dollar wasn't down when the last cards were released :)

Damn ATI

I have been waiting for the 6800 to come out - coz when it hits Australia I am building a new comp. All was good I knew what I was getting clear-cut 6800 was the only option...now I have to toss up between two cards...why can't life be simple.:P

Quote from Killx2:
I have been waiting for the 6800 to come out - coz when it hits Australia I am building a new comp. All was good I knew what I was getting clear-cut 6800 was the only option...now I have to toss up between two cards...why can't life be simple.:P

get the x800pro... "00US less than the 6800 and better performance ;)

Quote from dualith:
get the x800pro... "00US less than the 6800 and better performance ;)

Nah for me its either the xt or the 6800 ultra - the x800 pro is good but its going to die quickly it doesn't have the muscle of the other two cards and only beats the 6800 with Anisotropic filtering turned on and even then not all the time. At this point it looks like the ATI card takes the cake but the 6800 is definately going to have a longer life with its support for shader 3.0 etc etc etc, I am just wondering if it will come into it's own as the drivers for the card and the software catch up.

James, you should consider waiting a little bit longer (yeh I know, waited long enough ;)) and go for the 6850Ultra (6800Ultra Extreme or something) - I think those are the Asus cards you were talking about. Expect a review from Anandtech soon.

Yeah I was considering waiting for the 6850 (yeah I want to get an Asus card) - u have any idea how much delay that will be behind the other ones. I mean it would be nice to get it sooner but I can get by with my PC at the moment and if it would be a considerable step up in power I would wait. You know much about it?

Nah, I know next to nothing about it. Don't know release dates or specs... heh. I know it's coming 'soon' according to Anand.

lol - things always seem to be coming soon but never actually be here. Oh well I don't really see any of the card being available in Australia really quickly so I'll just see how it pans out I guess.

Asus, schmasas. Get a real mans card, get a Hercules. :)

Herc don't produce nV cards... So it's kind of pointless :)

Quote from Killx2:
At this point it looks like the ATI card takes the cake but the 6800 is definately going to have a longer life with its support for shader 3.0

by the time there are games that use SM3.0 as a baseline feature, the 6800 will be obsolete ;)

Pixel shader 3 gives identical shader quality to pixel shader 2, the main difference being that ps3 allows an unlimited amount of instructions in one shader while ps2 has a max of either 64 or 96, cant remember which. However no game, not even games currently in development (including hl2), contain shaders with near the ps2 max limit of instructions. vs3 has quite a few benefits from vs2, most notably being the new method of doing a bump-map like effect on textures which looks impressive, but IMO these benefits arent enough to choose a generally inferior card over one that doesnt have these features.

I wouldn't call the nV card inferior. That's plain ignorance.

OpenGL -> nV
DX8 -> ATi/nV are equal pretty much across the board.
DX9 -> ATi takes the lead. The 6800 is close though and the difference will be negligible when sound etc are turned on. (Sound is off in these benchmarks...)

Anisotropic Filtering -> ATi
AA -> ATi/nV. If you want to be able to run >4xAA go the ATi. <4xAA is dependent on the API (DX9, DX8 or OGL - the list above remains pretty much the same when 2 and 4xAA is enabled.)

As another note, it seems like nV is getting shit about their drivers being coded poorly. Instability issues and supposed cheating again are insults being flung around. And it looks like nV has been using Application Detection - modifying the settings of the drivers based on the name of the application, giving greater performance at the cost of IQ - for games like Far Cry.

The way its going it might just depend on which high end card is available fist as to which one I end up with. I wouldn't mind seeing how both of the cards perform in D3 and battle for middle earth...

I said generally inferior, like inferior in everything you want it for :P
IMO any games that require or run better on OpenGL are old enough that anything will run them, afaik Serious Sam 2 is the latest OGL game (prove me wrong, because i really don't know)

and even off your list there, if ATi/nV are even at everything else except AA and AF where the ATi card prevails, then it wouldn't be wrong to say that the 6800 is inferior.

Call Of Duty is the latest OGL game.

But then there's Doom 3... Where, even with AA enabled, the 6800Ultra will, more than likely, beat the ATi card.

Carmack isn't even writing certain DX paths for nVidia since the release of the 6800U - he was during the FX days. Which has got to say something about the confidence of nV and iD...

...plus, the D3 engine will be widely used. As the Q3 engine was... in oh so many games.

Then again, there's the Half Life engine... ;)

Quote from rec:
Asus, schmasas. Get a real mans card, get a Hercules. :)

Didn't Hercules stop making ATi cards due to something about not being allowed to sell them with the heavily superior modifications they put on it?
Like Hercules are generally known for taking the card and making it better but I am sure I heard that ATi disallowed that kind of practice...

Quote from Seqo:
Call Of Duty is the latest OGL game.

there we go, and look at the massive benchmarks that the ATi cards get for CoD

its hard to notice the difference between 180 and 230 FPS anyway :P

Go the Sapphiretech. Only card to have :) my Sapphire 9700 Pro still humms along nicely. Longest lasting card (spec wise, keeping up with the latest games) I have had in a long time. Bought it November 2002.

much as I like to bag nVidia (I'm an ATi boy myself :) ) I'm really hoping they get some good products on the shelf and fix their drivers so they can compete with ATi. More competition = lower prices.

x800 pro is retail in australia
http://www.razorprices.com/hardware_list.php?search=AND&searchword=x800&x=0&y=0&hardware=Video_Card

$735 for a cheapo brand one
$835 for a sapphire :eek:

edit: and so is geforce 6800 ultra
http://www.razorprices.com/hardware_list.php?x=0&y=0&searchword=6800&sort=price&list=ASC&search=AND&page_limit=50&hardware=video_card

FOR $995 :eek: thats just rediculous

*drools*

Saving as of now :).

i had my finger on the order button and decided to wait for the x800 xt's, heh.

they'll be priced to match 6800 ultras though :(

oh well. i dont care :D